Ever wondered why you can nail a presentation with friends but completely freeze when it's time to deliver it to your team or at a big pitch? In this episode of 9 to 5 Wellness, Aesha is joined by Dr. David Lee Fish — a communication expert who's spent decades helping professionals, performers, and athletes close the gap between their expertise and their delivery under pressure.
Dr. Fish's approach has an unusual origin story: it traces back to his early career as a saxophone player and later professor, and to studying under Zen master Seung Sahn. That training led him to a method that closely parallels mindfulness, built around one core idea — acceptance, not resistance, is the key to managing performance anxiety.
In this episode, you'll learn:
- The three factors that trigger performance anxiety — and why 75% of us are wired to feel itThe role of the amygdala ("your internal bodyguard") in fight, flight, or freeze responsesWhy trying to eliminate stage fright entirely is a "dead man's goal" — and what to aim for insteadThe Yerkes-Dodson finding on how the right amount of adrenaline actually improves performanceDr. Fish's practical READ framework for staying composed in high-stakes moments:
- Remember your core values behind the taskEngage fully with what you're doingAccept nervous thoughts and sensations without fighting themDetachment naturally follows
Memorable moment: Aesha shares advice from her Toastmasters mentor: when you're anxious about forgetting a detail or missing a stat, ask yourself — "Who will know that?"
Find out more about our guest Dr. David Lee Fish below:
- Website: riseup8.comLinkedIn: David Leifes
Time Markers
00:00 Welcome and Episode Setup
01:05 Meet Dr David Lee Fish
02:49 From Saxophone to Zen
06:27 Why We Freeze Under Pressure
08:04 Amygdala and Survival Mode
10:23 First Aid Accept It
13:41 Self Worth vs Symptoms
18:57 Stop Chasing Zero Fear
20:42 Adrenaline Sweet Spot
24:52 READ Framework Explained
30:09 When Your Mind Goes Blank
36:08 Where to Find Dr Fish
37:35 Closing Thanks and Goodbye
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